Question What is the Orbiter Visualization Project

[unknown]

What is Orbiter Visualization Project?

 

[Scrooge McDuck]

The Orbiter Visualization Project is about splitting the computational Orbiter core from the graphics you see, when you run a scenario.
Up to version 060929, we where limited to use the (DirectX) graphics because it was build into orbiter itself.
From now on, Martin appears to try to split this part, so he can focus on the computational/physics part, while others can make graphics clients, using any graphics API they want (like another DirectX version, or OpenGL, or even a client with no graphics at all).

Because the Orbiter project is getting large (for one person), one of the advantages of splitting functionality is that we could see quicker development, as different people can focus on different parts of Orbiter, instead of one person having to do all (without the need of having to make Orbiter a full-open source project).

regards,
mcduck

 

[unknown]

What are the effects of Orbiter Visualization Project?

 

[RAF92_Moser]

Updated graphics!

 

[pete.dakota]

I imagine, also, that if the graphics and the computation are being separated, then slow down/short freezes caused by the loading/unloading/drawing of textures/models will not cause any anomaly in the physics of what you're seeing. For instance if you were holding prograde in LEO and upped the time acel too 1000x, even though the display may seem to hang every few seconds, your ship will not 'spazz' out or appear to deviate away from it's attitude like it does now.

 

[xmlnoob]

That sounds good, looking forward to see the result.

 

[James.Denholm]

(without the need of having to make Orbiter a full-open source project).

How is making Orbiter full-open source a bad thing?

 

[Mortov Molotov]

OFF TOPIC:

How is making Orbiter full-open source a bad thing?

Well, there have been discussions about that before, but bottomline: making Orbiter open-source is not necessary a bad thing, but it's up to Dr. Schweiger to decide that.


ON TOPIC:

Technical question about OVP: suppose you select a scenario. Won't there be technical problems when you load different graphical API's?

I mean: suppose you load an OpenGL 2.0 - based spacecraft addon into a DirectX 7 (Orbiter's default) Solar system? Or how about two different spacecraft: one DirectX 9 based and the other OpenGL 2.0 - based?

 

[Artlav]

Technical question about OVP: suppose you select a scenario. Won't there be technical problems when you load different graphical API's?

I mean: suppose you load an OpenGL 2.0 - based spacecraft addon into a DirectX 7 (Orbiter's default) Solar system? Or how about two different spacecraft: one DirectX 9 based and the other OpenGL 2.0 - based?

There should be no problems in general, since all the general parts of the vessel are API-independent, but in some areas there are.

The problems are to be expected in 2D graphics part - all the hi-level custom drawings (custom HUD's, all of MFD's, most of panels, things like vessel's name on the wing, dynamic texturing, etc) are done using GDI interface, which is not available in OpenGL and probably won't be in many custom systems.

That problem description and some solutions are described in this thread at M6: http://www.orbitersim.com/Forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=13922

One of the work-arounds for it is to make a generic 2D drawing class defined in the core, and leave it's implementation to the graphics client.

Allowing the older add-ons to work in the new system is tricky, it's either an unfeasible task of making a GDI emulation for every client, or just denying the handles if the client do not have GDI_compatible flag set or similar.

Just dropping the add-on compatibility for all pre-08 things could really benefit the design of Orbiter, but it will make it nearly useless for a while it will take the developers to update and adapt.

 

[myles]

Sorry to bump, but I tried installing this, and there are little instructions. I can't get the shadows, and the only difference I notice are some nicer sun reflections on the Earth. Here's what I've done so far:
1: Installed Orbiter 2006
2: Installed Orbiter 2007 Beta
3: Install OGLA 080307

Anything else I need to do?
Thanks!

 

[unussapiens]

Check to OGLA thread at M6, there was a set of instructions there (somewhere around page 8 I think).

 

[amalahama]

Artlav, Martins knows all the problem with the 2D stuff? Maybe some solution are in process? It's weird that we can't plenty enjoy of your OVP yet

Regards!!

 

[myles]

Check to OGLA thread at M6, there was a set of instructions there (somewhere around page 8 I think).

Hmm. Here's what it says:

Running:
Put into Orbiter directory tree root, run.
Requires glut and OpenGL support, preferrably with direct rendering.
Case-sensitivity can be a problem, ogla set to case you get if you unzip the Orbiter distribution on windows, then copy over.
If it won't be able to find certain files, it will print the path it looks for in the console for you to check the case/presence.

I've downloaded glut and VBO, and I still get this line in my OGLA.log:

 INIT| OGLA, GLGR, VBO 080307

I think that means it wants me to still download those, even though I have. Where do I need to install the GLUT files and the VBO files? Are there any certain Orbiter settings? Do I run Orbiter NG or just regular Orbiter?

Thanks

EDIT: Weirdly, when running Orbiter NG, there is no sun, but there is light...

EDIT: How do I do this?:

" Make sure you select OpenGL as a rendering device in "Video" tab."

 

[Artlav]

Artlav, Martins knows all the problem with the 2D stuff? Maybe some solution are in process? It's weird that we can't plenty enjoy of your OVP yet

He appears to be aware that there are problems with OVP, since even his own DX7 client crashes from time to time. There was no updates regarding OVP for a while as he is either busy or taking his time.

Sorry to bump, but I tried installing this, and there are little instructions. I can't get the shadows, and the only difference I notice are some nicer sun reflections on the Earth. Here's what I've done so far:
1: Installed Orbiter 2006
2: Installed Orbiter 2007 Beta
3: Install OGLA 080307

Anything else I need to do?

Have you installed a matching beta (070927)?
So, you installed them all, then what?
Have you run the Orbiter_NG.exe?
Have you activated the OGLAClient in modules tab?

I've downloaded glut and VBO, and I still get this line in my OGLA.log:

Hm, what?
Whatever VBO you downloaded, it's not the VBO (Vertex Buffer Objects, repetitive rendering speed-up thru storing meshes on GPU) referenced in OGLA, and glut is only used in Linux version...

Are you trying to run it in Windows or on Linux?

I think that means it wants me to still download those, even though I have. Where do I need to install the GLUT files and the VBO files?

It means the version string of OGLA including the features compiled in, no extra downloads needed.

Are there any certain Orbiter settings? Do I run Orbiter NG or just regular Orbiter?
How do I do this?:
"Make sure you select OpenGL as a rendering device in "Video" tab."

Run Orbiter_NG, Go to modules tab, activate OGLAClient, go to video tab, set the settings, select the scenario with (OGLA) tag to be on a safe side and press the launch button.

 

[Cornflake]

Sorry to bump, but I tried installing this, and there are little instructions. I can't get the shadows, and the only difference I notice are some nicer sun reflections on the Earth. Here's what I've done so far:
1: Installed Orbiter 2006
2: Installed Orbiter 2007 Beta
3: Install OGLA 080307

Anything else I need to do?
Thanks!

Maybe I missed it somwhere; but where can I find the most recent beta and OVP packages? Here? ORBITER beta packages

 

[myles]

Yes, get the Orbiter Beta there, and OVP here: http://orbides.1gb.ru/ (OGLA)

 

[Cornflake]

Now, once you have OGLA installed, do you run it by going to the Orbiter_NG executable or the standard one? Because I can only activate OGLA in the standard beta orbiter.exe.

 

[DaveS]

Now, once you have OGLA installed, do you run it by going to the Orbiter_NG executable or the standard one? Because I can only activate OGLA in the standard beta orbiter.exe.

Orbiter_NG. NG is short for No Graphics as it doesn't have a graphics engine embedded like the default Orbiter.exe.

 

[Cornflake]

Yes, I know that the NG is the executable without imbedded graphics. That's why I was wondering as to whether I needed to use that one when using another graphics client like OGLA. It appears OGLA only runs with the standard Orbiter executable.

I don't have any modules to activate when launching Orbiter_NG.

 

[DaveS]

I don't have any modules to activate when launching Orbiter_NG.

Did you edit the Orbiter_NG shortcut that came with the Orbiter beta release?