Russia 'to save its ISS modules'

[Notebook]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8064060.stm

N.

 

[SiberianTiger]

Of course yes:

 

[Orbinaut Pete]

I think this is a very bad idea.

Remember how Mir started to fall apart at the end of it's life...

I can see the same thing hapening here...

 

[Urwumpe]

Who is going to pay this?

 

[Pquardzvaark]

I can't imagine that flying what will be 30-40 year old modules in deep space to Mars to be a very intelligent idea. Hell, all those problems Mir had multiplied.

Hope NASA can get funding to operate the ISS longer than 2015. It seems a waste to only use a product that could take 13 years to complete for a total of 4 years.

 

[SiberianTiger]

Oh, I see some audience coming!

I think this is a very bad idea.

Remember how Mir started to fall apart at the end of it's life...

I can see the same thing hapening here...

First thing, the Mir did not literally fall apart. The primary issue with it was the cooling system, which was too tightly coupled with the hull which make it impossible to service and search for leaks of the coolant. Failed cooling lead to heavy organic contamination of the interior. Plus there was a fire and a decompression of a module. The whole chain lead to delays in other service works. I believe it's possible to design such critical systems otherwise.

Secondly, note the spherical docking node down below the big vertical module (on the pic). When the time comes for the Zvezda to be jettisoned, another replacement core module will be docked to this node. And the other way round, the next replacement (not necessarily a DOS-like anymore) will be docked to the former Zvezda's place. That's a modularity on high.

Who is going to pay this?

Me when I pay my taxes. And you when you fill your car's tank. The question is irrelevant: we will either have a space activity goining on (surely requiring some money), or stop flying to space.

I can't imagine that flying what will be 30-40 year old modules in deep space to Mars to be a very intelligent idea.

Read the article carefully. Nobody is going to do what you say. The station is just going to be turned to a space wharf.

Hell, all those problems Mir had multiplied.

Only those never do mistakes who do nothing.

 

[Pquardzvaark]

Oops, sorry. Looks like I misread part of the article. The concept doesn't sound so bad now. It does seem like a future that maybe even in human interplanetary travel that re-usable deep space transports would make sense more than single-use so testing out the limits of how long these space station modules can last would be a good idea.

What I thought I read on the order hand...

Anyway, no harm.

 

[Zachstar]

We own Zarya so they wont exactly get that much off the space station. Unless they want to buy the thing from us.

 

[Suzy]

Is it possible the detached Russian modules could be utilized as a basic spaceship to Mars, say with a module containing a nuclear reactor on the end added (to power electric engines)? This page from a 1987 book at Astronaut.ru features a spaceship design that looks a little like the Russian ISS segment (i.e. linear module layout), with a propulsion module and lander added.

 

[Zachstar]

Not with people onboard.

 

[Ark]

I don't see why we couldn't cannibalize some of the modules for an interplanetary flight. It's certainly a LOT cheaper, we've already spent the energy to get the things in orbit.

 

[Zachstar]

I don't see why we couldn't cannibalize some of the modules for an interplanetary flight. It's certainly a LOT cheaper, we've already spent the energy to get the things in orbit.

Because they are rated for LEO use.

For instance they are designed to spend part of the time in orbital shadow. Somthing you do not get on a 6 month cruise to mars. The cost needed to change that would be extreme.

Also these modules are designed for a 6 month stay with massive support from Earth. Not a 3 year trek.

There is NO ISS parts to mars.. period.

 

[Suzy]

Because they are rated for LEO use.

For instance they are designed to spend part of the time in orbital shadow. Somthing you do not get on a 6 month cruise to mars. The cost needed to change that would be extreme.

Also these modules are designed for a 6 month stay with massive support from Earth. Not a 3 year trek.

There is NO ISS parts to mars.. period.

Didn't think of that. What element of the design is for orbital shadow?

 

[Andy44]

Thermal control, for starters.

 

[SiberianTiger]

We own Zarya so they wont exactly get that much off the space station. Unless they want to buy the thing from us.

How much is that? $220 million? To be just, let's have it discounted down to $150 million for it being a second-hand and us already doing maintenance (thus effectively paying the wear and tear costs). Okay, we'll give you a lift in three Soyuz round-trips free of charge for that!

 

[Zachstar]

It depends on how much equipment we have tied up in it.

For instance I remember a big debate about selling the ISS to Russia or China after 2016. This was proved impossible because the US segment has communications equipment and the like that are not to be sold or handed over. It cant be ripped out without completely ruining the segment from what I hear.

My guess is even if we can sell it we will strip it first and what yall will get will be little more than a hollow shell that is falling apart. It wont even be habitable by 2020 and likely will have to be abandoned shortly after 2016 anyway due to nearly 2 decades of wear and tear.

Like Mir Zarya is not some invincible icon. And because the US paid for it one needs to look at it with even more suspition because while yall built it. Its not "Yalls" so im sure not as much engineering love went into it.

If yall were smart yall would let ISS deorbit completely and work with china to build a new station. China seems not so hellbent on beating us back to the moon so my guess is they would be happy to do a joint space station with yall.

---------- Post added at 03:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:51 AM ----------

The more I think about the more it seems silly to even consider Zarya.

The MUCH better idea in my view is to cannibalize it along with anything else that is not protected by US law and willing to be given up by NASA and the various other partners to better the service module.

After detaching it you would be able to use the docking port on zarya for deorbit ops.

The only thing left from Russia that will make it to ISS in my view is the module being launched on the shuttle. Russia is not going to launch a science module that will only have less than 5 years of use. It will take over 1 just to get things going!

Nope in the end if you want to do ANYTHING with yalls segment detach the service module and use it as a 2 man salyut type station for simple experiments. Maybe even launch someone from china for a joint mission?

 

[Urwumpe]

Me when I pay my taxes. And you when you fill your car's tank. The question is irrelevant: we will either have a space activity goining on (surely requiring some money), or stop flying to space.

Don't plan too far, I plan to retire my car. Maybe you need to drop one or more modules from the plans then.

 

[Moonwalker]

Mark this:

The ISS will deorbit completely, after its life time extension.

 

[Urwumpe]

The ISS will deorbit completely, after its life time extension.

I suspect you will be right this time, but I also want to add: De-orbit after the successor is in construction. We will get a successor for the ISS, and I hope it's career will start with less troubles.

And I also want to be prophetic again: It will include the USA again, but not again with 70% of the funding.

 

[Zachstar]

I seriously seriously doubt it.

The only way they will build another ISS is with the help of China. So it is VERY unlikely we will be involved. More than likely building 1 or two smaller stations of our own instead.