News Contact lost with 777-200ER of Malaysia Airlines

[garyw]

I think in all depends on how the aircraft hit the water. If it was "suicide by autopilot", then it all depends how the 777 autopilot will behave when fuel runs out at cruise altitude... And I think that some investigator is trying that on simulator as we speak.

I'd expect a lot of warnings and then autopilot disconnect followed by a glide into the ocean at around 250mph.

Also, I have a feeling that after this crash someone will propose that the planes should be made remotely controllable to protect from pilot insanity.

which then opens up a whole new area of cyber terrorism and that has already been suggested for this one.

 

[kamaz]

The pings were sent every 30 minutes and the arcs seem to be related to the elevation angle of the satellite -- this information is apparently transmitted by the terminal on aircraft.

While it's understandable that the final position of the aircraft would be somewhere along the constant elevation arc, what doesn't make sense to me are repeated media assertions that the arcs represent the path of the aircraft. There's absolutely no reason why the aircraft would fly along the constant elevtion arc. Rather, each ping would give you one arc, which should be enough to work out the approximate flight path given the timing information and the assumption that the aircraft was moving in a straight line.

 

[Urwumpe]

The pings were sent every 30 minutes and the arcs seem to be related to the elevation angle of the satellite -- this information is apparently transmitted by the terminal on aircraft.

different pings. The 30 minutes are the Engine Condition Monitoring packets, which use their own integrated system. The satellite pings are hourly, sent by the satellite antenna itself to maintain pointing data to the satellite. The location was very likely calculated by doppler shift and pseudo range, similar to GPS calculations, but much much coarser, because of the lack of a comparable time source. elevation angle and pseudo-range are directly related for geostationary satellites.

 

[kamaz]

Neglecting Earth curvature, you have

pseudo_range = satellite_altitude/sin(elevation_angle)

so pseudo range and elevation angle are measuring the same thing.

 

[garyw]

The only person who is talking any sense in my opinion:

How Inmarsat came up with their southern route solution:

 

[Yoda]

Despite all the "data" it seems a little premature to come to a firm conclusion about what happened to this aircraft without any hard evidence.
Nothing concrete has been found and I can't help but wonder if this isn't just a way to "get rid of the problem" with all the media hype.

I have a hard time believing this pilot flew for 7 hours just to kill himself and everybody on board; seems a bit far fetched.

Mechanical error doesn't fly with me either; several pieces of equipment were manually shut off to disguise the location of the aircraft.

There is more to this then meets the eye............

 

[Urwumpe]

There is more to this then meets the eye............

Yes, but you know: Pretending to know more, is a worse sign of stupidity, than to admit that you have no clue. :facepalm:

 

[garyw]

Despite all the "data" it seems a little premature to come to a firm conclusion about what happened to this aircraft without any hard evidence.
Nothing concrete has been found and I can't help but wonder if this isn't just a way to "get rid of the problem" with all the media hype.

I have a hard time believing this pilot flew for 7 hours just to kill himself and everybody on board; seems a bit far fetched.

Mechanical error doesn't fly with me either; several pieces of equipment were manually shut off to disguise the location of the aircraft.

There is more to this then meets the eye............

I completely agree and whilst I don't want to start going on about conspiracy theories it does seem that the Malaysians just want to say 'Oh well, that's it. it has crashed. no point in worrying about - what's next?'

 

[Yoda]

My fear is that in the next few days they will "conveniently" find some small pieces of a boeing 777 ( not necessarily from this particular flight )to prove their statement and thus be able to close the case as "lost at sea".
Just my hunch........

 

[Quick_Nick]

It was a muslim plot to pull aircraft into black holes through acts of god that can only be detected by psychics.

http://thedailyshow.cc.com/videos/6lqtfn/the-curious-case-of-flight-370

 

[Urwumpe]

As if Malaysia has ANYTHING to say in that matter.

 

[Thunder Chicken]

My fear is that in the next few days they will "conveniently" find some small pieces of a boeing 777 ( not necessarily from this particular flight )to prove their statement and thus be able to close the case as "lost at sea".
Just my hunch........

Nah, they'll find some 1930's vintage wreckage of a Lockheed Electra (S/N NR16020) and mistake it for 777 wreckage.

 

[gattispilot]

The best line I heard it not like looking for a needle in a haystack. We don't even know where the haystack is.

 

[Quick_Nick]

The best line I heard it not like looking for a needle in a haystack. We don't even know where the haystack is.

Also
http://orbiter-forum.com/showthread.php?p=460327&postcount=283

 

[C3PO]

The best line I heard it not like looking for a needle in a haystack. We don't even know where the haystack is.

Finding stuff in the ocean is very much harder than most people realize.

"...Like finding a piece of hay in a giant pile of needles" - Edmund Blackadder

 

[garyw]

300 floating debris like objects have been spotted by another satellite - Thaicote.

And a better resolution of one of the images:

Rather than just being one or two items, this does look like an actual debris field to me.

 

[garyw]

No idea how accurate this is but.........

A Malaysian team have told relatives of Chinese passengers on board the missing Malaysia Airlines (MAS) flight MH370 that there was sealed evidence that cannot be made public, as they came under fire from the angry relatives at a briefing on Wednesday.

The sealed evidence included air traffic control radio transcript, radar data and airport security recordings.

The briefing at the Metropark Lido Hotel in Beijing focused on UK satellite analysis which led Malaysia to conclude that flight MH370 ended in south Indian Ocean, off Perth.

The Chinese relatives were told that a five-member high-level team from Malaysia plans to brief them once every five days. The team include MAS pilot Lim Jit Koon and senior civil aviation official Ahmad Nizar Zolfakar.

During the question-and-answer session, a relative said: “Thanks for demonstrating your ability to read every word out of the powerpoint slides.”

Another asked: “If the info is from UK satellite firm Inmarsat, does it mean the Malaysia team cannot answer our questions on the MH370 analysis?”

Faced with the barrage of questions from the angry relatives, the MAS team replied: “We can answer but we might not be correct as we’re not the investigators”

Meanwhile, The cyclone that is causing problems for the search teams:

 

[garyw]

Another day and a new map......

We also have a plane seeing debris:

A plane has spotted "objects" in the new area of the Indian Ocean being searched for missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370, Australian officials say.

The sightings would need confirmation by ship, which is not expected until tomorrow, the Australian Maritime Safety Authority (Amsa) said.

Earlier it was announced the search would now focus on an area 1,100km (700 miles) north-east of the previous zone.

The Beijing-bound airliner disappeared on 8 March with 239 people on board.

The identity of the objects - spotted by a Royal New Zealand Air Force Orion - were "to be established", Amsa said.

Basically, they are still chasing debris shadows. This could go on for weeks.

 

[Lucy]

This could go on for weeks.

Or, indeed, months - how much plausible debris could they find in the ocean, after all? There's probably an awful lot of things floating about that have absolutely nothing to do with any kind of aircraft - not that this would be obviously visible from a satellite, of course. And, considering how long it has now been since the aircraft disappeared (and theoretically crashed into the water) how far could something have drifted by now?

 

[MattBaker]

Or, indeed, months

Considering they have to get the useful stuff from the wreckage which probably lies somewhere on the ocean floor, probably 10,000+ feet down...yeah, this could take a while.