Car industry bailout?

[ar81]

Wealth distribution in US is done via employment, not via government bailout to citizens.
Employment is in the hands of executives who make poor decisions.
Executives want government to bailout their poor decisions, using employment as excuse.

So it seems that US distribution of wealth is being hijacked by people who make bad decisions and want taxpayers money to subsidize their decisions, while keeping employees as hostages.

Do you think that a car industry bailout should take place?

 

[Bj]

Wealth distribution in US is done via employment, not via government bailout to citizens.
Employment is in the hands of executives who make poor decisions.
Executives want government to bailout their poor decisions, using employment as excuse.

So it seems that US distribution of wealth is being hijacked by people who make bad decisions and want taxpayers money to subsidize their decisions, while keeping employees as hostages.

Do you think that a car industry bailout should take place?

Only and I mean only if there is a law put in place for them to make the cars cheaper, and / or more fuel efficient. It is just stupid for them to continue selling cars at $40,000 for a car. If they are 'bailed out' the community is still not going to pay them for their cars, which rounds back to square 1.

The industry should only get funding for the development of cheaper and cleaner cars, because in the long run, cheaper and cleaner cars means that they would have more buyers.

 

[Urwumpe]

No bail-out, but also not leaving the economy in shatters. The new government is now in the ugly situation that it has to clean the mess of a disaster, which came with an appointment - the bad situation inside the US car industry was known for almost a decade, and it did not happen too early, the sub-prime crisis actually brought the US car industry two or three years more.

Important is: The big car companies in the USA can't go on. The management and the owners of the companies have shown that they are not able to manage these enterprises. Even if they feel different - the truth is, that they currently are only able to blackmail the country.

So, if you want to punish the right people, you have to distribute the punishment in the following order:
- Owners (They should control the management)
- Management (for ruining the US car industry)
- Labor Unions (They don't feel like that, but they had been even less flexible as the US customer)
- US government (For not seeing the long term consequences)
- Customers (For ruining the US car industry - even if not intended)

And you can be sure - if you don't distribute the punishment that way, for example by launching the world into a car industry subsidize spiral to keep the US car industry and all influenced industries alive, you increase the damage. At the end, only one group will have to pay the mess if you do a bail-out: The customers and tax-payers.

Instead, I think there are enough examples of small US companies with good ideas to improve the US car industry. Utilize their ideas. GM will soon be worth so little, that even Tesla Roadsters could buy a plant of them and define the price.

 

[cjp]

You can say they deserve to be punished, but currently the economy seems to be like a domino game, so if you allow this branch to fall, a lot of innocent people will be hurt too.

That doesn't mean they shouldn't be punished. They just shouldn't get the "death penalty". Make sure they survive, but also make sure they really need to improve themselves in order to survive. And, if people have to be fired because of economical forces, make it go slow enough to allow people to find new jobs.

This is also an excellent opportunity to explain to the industry how to prepare for the future. Maybe the bailout can be made dependent on what kind of cars are produced. Light and fuel-efficient is definitely what we need.

 

[Zatnikitelman]

Let's hope first they don't get bailed out, then second ford gets fined about 2 billion dollars for building shoddy PoSs that fall apart when you go to turn the left turn-signal on!

 

[RisingFury]

No.

At least one of these companies should be left to fail. Survival of the fittest, right? I though they called it capitalism

 

[eveningsky339]

Why should we bail out American companies that churn out these large gas-hogs? I'd much rather buy a more efficient and higher quality European or Japanese car.

Let the blundering big-car companies die out. We could do without them.


-----Post Added-----

No.

At least one of these companies should be left to fail. Survival of the fittest, right? I though they called it capitalism

That's more like social Darwinism...

 

[Brad]

Let them fail! They can only blame themselves for not listening to their consumers. There is always chapter 11, which anyone can claim for protection from creditors.

 

[Urwumpe]

I'd much rather buy a more efficient and higher quality European or Japanese car.

You don't want that - you actually just want a US car, with technology which is state of the art in Europe and Japan. You might not know it yet.

We have a pretty visible Dodge Viper in my region, a really beautiful racing car. Until you open the hood and see how primitive it is inside. Even a small Smart has better technology inside. A Viper with a good engine, lighter structures and modern suspension - that would be a car which holds what it's shape promises.

What speaks against Pickups? Many people have a reason to own one. But why do Pickups have to be build with so primitive technology, that even Amish can consider buying one? You can build robust utility engines with modern technology, if that is a constraint. Volkswagen has a really successful motorboat engine department, selling their high-performance Diesel engines to Yacht owners. With only small modifications to the automobile version. The only thing that stops US companies from developing such technology is the luxury of never having any real evolutionary pressure.

But please: Kill the SUVs. That is really the most useless poser car class around. Imagine a Porsche, which would have a hard time exceeding 100 km/h. Would you buy it? But why should somebody buy a SUV, which can't do anything at all good? It is no off-road car, because the suspension is too much optimized for roads. And has too much fancy stuff around which you don't want to damage when being in the terrain. And what is the sense behind having a large trunk, if you need a larger parking lot as a short-range jet airliner? And you can't use it for transporting your family because the ground clearance is too high for letting children enter easily.

 

[Missioncmdr]

Hell no!

They do not deserve the money. These bailouts are ruining the free-market system. Why is it that managers who drive their companies into the ground get rewarded? Answer that, and maybe I will change my answer.

 

[Melocoton]

Only and I mean only if there is a law put in place for them to make the cars cheaper, and / or more fuel efficient. It is just stupid for them to continue selling cars at $40,000 for a car.

I don't really think (and not trying to offend American supporters) that American makers would do that. Their interpretation of fuel efficient is 24 mpg. (wow, and Asia can do 40+ while Europe does better than just hybrids) Also consider that Asia's cars with more than 30 mpg offered are often only $20,000 or less. I think we should stop this constant bailout for corporations and banks.. It's rediculous, and America cannot afford it. Sorry to say, but I don't even think our cars are worth saving. Our workers, yes, but.. There's gotta be another way. Yes, I think the bailout should go through with some strict limits on the automakers, but otherwise no. Consider the fact that with our last Bailout, Exxon Mobil got quite a chunk. Maybe I just don't remember some sort of cry for reasonable help from them, but.. Why? What for? Aren't they already plenty rich and plentiful?

 

[Bj]

I don't really think (and not trying to offend American supporters) that American makers would do that. Their interpretation of fuel efficient is 24 mpg. (wow, and Asia can do 40+ while Europe does better than just hybrids) Also consider that Asia's cars with more than 30 mpg offered are often only $20,000 or less.

I don't even have the slightest hope that they would do that. (lower prices)

It would be way too much to ask if they could do both lower prices, and raise MPGs, not the other way around.

Why cant they just copy for foreign technology? Or find some technology under GNU license :lol: