Is Orbiter dying a slow death ???

[PhantomCruiser]

I agree with you in a fashion. Would-be developers could police themselves.

We've seen a whole handfull of stations built with Artlav's shipyard that appear on the hangar, with little thought going into construction. There are several launchers that make me scratch my head an go "huh?". And some add-ons just make me go "Uh, O-K..."

When I'm digging around on the hangar there are a few things I look for, I don't think too much of the rating, it can be deceptive (there are some really good add-ons with low ratings), I look at who made it (let's face it, there are some really, really talented developers who do this stuff for free), I look at download count, and which version of Orbiter it was made for. A slick looking base for and older version can still work with a bit of modification, while some older things may not work at all.

I've got about a dozen projects that need major rework before I ever consider letting someone else see them, while they worked for me as a stepping stone, I'd be embarassed to put them up on the hangar. I was nervous enough about letting Energia-M loose. I mean, Kultch's stuff is awesome, my stuff can't compare to his. But then I never intended to compete with them. It augments the program, and it hadn't been done (until now). And this was my first ever add-on, which is easy to discover by a simple mouse click.

I'd hate to think that hangar uploads would have to pass through a critical review process by commitee before being made available.

Orbiter isn't dying, far from it. That said there are a many "kids" who think StarTrek/Star Wars physics is more realistic/exciting. But then, they also probably haven't bothered to attempt to dead-stick an XR-5 into WideAwake fro LEO lately either.

Oh, anybody seen how the particle smoke dissipates in the beta? Too cool. :thumbup:

 

[Scruce]

Ok, here is an example:

It is an early satellite/interplanetary probe concept. I made it a few weeks ago, it is all complete configuration wise, has solar panel animations and a few scenarios. But here is the catch; I am not going to release it on Orbit Hangar Mods.

So, if I am not going to release it on OHM, why did I make it?

Well, the answer is simple; I made it as a testbed. I learned about complex texture mapping and conical projections through it, and can now apply that to any future addons that I might make. But in no way does it deserve an upload to OHM, because, it is just too simple. Sure, it has a pretty mesh and texture, but simplicity. People will not like it, because it is not all in the eye candy, you know.

So, here is my point. If you make an addon, think to yourself; Is it really worthy of an upload?, Will people like it and use it again and again?. I do not condone the use of Spacecraft3, it is a wonderful thing, without it I would be stuck to just meshing things over and over again before leaving them lying on my hard drive (not that I do that already :shifty. I am just saying; try to make it as interesting and worthy as possible.

But what constitutes as worthy? Well, if you really think that you are ready to be making complex addons, have made a good mesh, nicely textured it, added some good features in the configuration (animations, separations, etc.) and the most important thing; did the research, then go for it and upload.

Maybe we do need a panel of judges, not to enforce the points I made above, but to stop blatantly awful addons, such as single scenario uploads or overuse of Station Shipyard.

Or, instead of judges, how about a little guide when you upload you addon, such as what to upload or what not to upload, as an alternative solution.

 

[Keatah]

There are plenty of "1x1x1 useless satellites" and "cargo modules" and paint jobs that do nothing other than idolize entertainment franchises. Many of these add-ons do nothing to the orbiter experience except consume disk space. The same thing applies to the skinning concept. Unless the paint job means something to you personally, it's all stuff & fluff.

 

[PhantomCruiser]

Maybe we could encourage people to rate add-ons? But how to ensure "fairness", and how to encourage?

 

[Pipcard]

Skins do nothing to the Orbiter experience? I made my Miku XR2 skin because I wanted to enhance that experience (at least for me and any other Vocaloid fans here). Same goes for River Crab's pony skins.*

I see lots of skins and UCGO cargoes (that don't unpack), but where are all the 1x1x1 satellites?

*no, I'm not going to compare myself to her again

 

[Lucy]

Ok, here is an example:

It is an early satellite/interplanetary probe concept. I made it a few weeks ago, it is all complete configuration wise, has solar panel animations and a few scenarios. But here is the catch; I am not going to release it on Orbit Hangar Mods.

So, if I am not going to release it on OHM, why did I make it?

Well, the answer is simple; I made it as a testbed. I learned about complex texture mapping and conical projections through it, and can now apply that to any future addons that I might make. But in no way does it deserve an upload to OHM, because, it is just too simple. Sure, it has a pretty mesh and texture, but simplicity. People will not like it, because it is not all in the eye candy, you know.

So, here is my point. If you make an addon, think to yourself; Is it really worthy of an upload?, Will people like it and use it again and again?. I do not condone the use of Spacecraft3, it is a wonderful thing, without it I would be stuck to just meshing things over and over again before leaving them lying on my hard drive (not that I do that already :shifty. I am just saying; try to make it as interesting and worthy as possible.

But what constitutes as worthy? Well, if you really think that you are ready to be making complex addons, have made a good mesh, nicely textured it, added some good features in the configuration (animations, separations, etc.) and the most important thing; did the research, then go for it and upload.

Maybe we do need a panel of judges, not to enforce the points I made above, but to stop blatantly awful addons, such as single scenario uploads or overuse of Station Shipyard.

Or, instead of judges, how about a little guide when you upload you addon, such as what to upload or what not to upload, as an alternative solution.

QFT. Nobody wants to see my first Orbiter modules. They were diabolical, but a necessary part of the learning curve.

 

[Scruce]

I made my Miku XR2 skin because I wanted to enhance that experience (at least for me and any other Vocaloid fans here).

If you were aware that it was only you who wanted to 'enhance that experience', why did you upload it to Orbit Hangar Mods? Surely you knew that OHM was a site for sharing addons?

I see lots of skins and UCGO cargoes (that don't unpack), but where are all the 1x1x1 satellites?

The '1x1x1 satellites' was an example, it can include all those annoying UCGO cargos.

 

[Pipcard]

I wanted to share with any Vocaloid fans in the Orbiter community.

 

[Scruce]

QFT

Quoted For Truth?

Are you agreeing with me or trying to stop me from going back on what I have said when you quoted me?

 

[Lucy]

If you were aware that it was only you who wanted to 'enhance that experience', why did you upload it to Orbit Hangar Mods? Surely you knew that OHM was a site for sharing addons?

Let's not bicker about that skin again. Everything has its market and there are clearly fans of the topic on the forum. Just because you and I may not be among them doesn't mean that such content shouldn't be present here or in OHM.

We're judging addons based on their quality, not their subject matter.

---------- Post added at 15:45 ---------- Previous post was at 15:44 ----------

Quoted For Truth?

Are you agreeing with me or trying to stop me from going back on what I have said when you quoted me?

Posting in agreement of the addon testing development approach.

 

[RisingFury]

If people only expect high-quality add-ons, it will only discourage the people who are newcomers to add-on development.

I wasn't discouraged. Nor were others that now make excellent addons.

 

[NovaSilisko]

If people expect high quality addons, that encourages me to try my best to make high quality addons.

I don't see the problem.

 

[mojoey]

why was this thread dug back up? Orbiter will not die. If Martin makes it open source, and then abandons it, im sure that several of us would pick up the slack...

 

[MaverickSawyer]

Amen to that, my friend.
and

 

[Pipcard]

If people expect high quality addons, that encourages me to try my best to make high quality addons.

I don't see the problem.

If people are pressured too much to make high-quality add-ons, most will be driven away (and they won't learn). As time goes on and elite add-on developers leave (they don't last forever), the newcomers won't be able to make the XR2s, Shuttle Fleets, etc. of old.

Besides, isn't Orbiter about having fun (along with serious physics)? People have the right to upload XR2 skins and UCGO cargoes, even though they aren't the best kind of add-on.

 

[Zatnikitelman]

You don't have to release every addon you make. Like other developers in this thread, I too have a fairly large stack of addons never completed and that I won't release, but that helped me learn along the way. For instance, a failed attempt at a mission framework taught me a lot about data structures which I later used in my released Prometheus's payload management code. I've got many other projects that didn't even get textured where I learned a lot about 3d modeling that I'm now applying to my truss system.
Not all of my stuff is expertly done either, but (at least I hope) it fills a niche. I could probably churn out a dozen generic satellites a week that are just variations on the same theme, but who would use them? I could also churn out a dozen space station modules that just extend solar panels and atennas, but where's the "market" for that? If I'm using them as a tool to improve my skills to where I can churn out good enough stuff that people will want, then there's no harm in making them.

 

[Cras]

its up to the person. I have made quite a few skins for the XR-2, the Space Shuttle, XR-5, DGIV for my own use. I wanted them to look a certain way, and I really don't think anyone would really be interested in them.

But if I was under the impression people were, then I would put them up on Orbit Hangar.

 

[Urwumpe]

Is it dead now?

 

[Cras]

Is it dead now?

Poke it with a stick and find out.

 

[Urwumpe]

Poke it with a stick and find out.

:ninja: