Question Spacecraft3 attachments.

[Notebook]

Put this question here, rather than the Blue Streak project thread as its generic, I think.

I can detach a spacecraft3 vessel after it is declared attached in a scenario, but can't re-attach it.

This is F2 vehicle attached to its handling frame, and an A-frame also atached to the handling frame.
http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k207/Notebook_04/09101211-32-10Handling_Frame.jpg

This is after selecting the A-Frame attachment point, and releasing it.
http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k207/Notebook_04/09101211-39-26Handling_Frame.jpg

I can move the handling frame about, with F2 still atached, and also detach the F2.
However I can't re-attach the A-Frame?

Tried all the configuration settings in the.scn file(0,1,2, 0 causes CTD). No effect. Tried different DIR and ROT settings for handling frame and A-Frame ini's.

Just wondering if this is possible on the surface?

These are the relevant files at the moment.

.SCN File

Handling_Frame:Spacecraft\Spacecraft3
STATUS Landed Earth
;BASE Woomera_6A:2
POS +136.444978 -31.079180 ; +136.445005 -31.079220
ATTACHED 0:0,BlueStreak_F2
ATTACHED 1:0,A_Frame
HEADING 90
FUEL 1.000
CONFIGURATION 2
CURRENT_PAYLOAD 0
END
A_Frame:Spacecraft\Spacecraft3
STATUS Landed Earth
;BASE Woomera_6A:2
POS +136.444978 -31.079180 ; +136.445005 -31.079220
ATTACHED 0:1,Handling_Frame
HEADING 90
FUEL 1.000
CONFIGURATION 2
CURRENT_PAYLOAD 0
END
BlueStreak_F2:Spacecraft\Spacecraft3
STATUS Landed Earth
;BASE Woomera_6A:2
POS +136.444978 -31.079180 ; +136.445005 -31.079220
ATTACHED 0:0,Handling_Frame
HEADING 90
FUEL 1.000
CONFIGURATION 2
CURRENT_PAYLOAD 0
END

Handling_Frame.ini

[PARENT_ATTACH_0]
NAME=Handling_Frame
POS=(1.5, 3, 0 )
DIR=(0,1,0)
ROT=(-1,0,0)
LOOSE=0
[PARENT_ATTACH_1]
NAME=A_FramePickUp
POS=(0, 0, 0 )
DIR=(0,0,1)
ROT=(0,1,0)
LOOSE=1

A_Frame.ini

[CHILD_ATTACH_0]
NAME=A_FramePickUp
POS=(0, 3, 9 )
DIR=(0,0,-1)
ROT=(0,1,0)
LOOSE=1

All help appreciated.

N.

 

[BrianJ]

Hi,
in the second screenie, it looks like the A-Frame is a couple of meters away from the Handling-Frame. Maybe the attachment point is simply out-of-range. Try setting the range to a large value like 10 or 20, like this:

[PARENT_ATTACH_0]
NAME=Handling_Frame
POS=(1.5, 3, 0 )
DIR=(0,1,0)
ROT=(-1,0,0)
LOOSE=0
[PARENT_ATTACH_1]
NAME=A_FramePickUp
POS=(0, 0, 0 )
DIR=(0,0,1)
ROT=(0,1,0)
LOOSE=1 
[B]RANGE=10[/B]

All the best,
Brian

 

[Notebook]

thanks for that BrianJ.

The second frame is just to show that the A-frame has detached and moved away, sorry I didn't make that clear above!
After I moved the handling frame away, I moved it back to the A-frame and tried to re-attach, no luck. Tried various distances, and the LOOSE and RANGE paramaters, no joy.

The good news is I tried your suggestions and that works! How strange.

Something is not right though, After detaching the A-frame, it fell slowly to the ground then bounced several hundred metres into the air. It eventually came back down quite close, so I moved the handling frame over to it, and it quite happily re-attched, marvellous.

Its probably something to do with LAUNCH/LAND points? I have just put some into the A-frame .ini. Just for fun...

Anyway, something to investigat, and now I know it can work.

Thanks for the input, N.

 

[Donamy]

I didn't know a child could be attached to two parents.

 

[Notebook]

I don't think I am doing that Donamy.

The "Handling_Frame" has two Parent_Attachments.
"BlueStreak_F2" has one Child_Attachment, and "A-Frame" has one Child_Attachment.

I could be wrong of course...

N.

 

[Donamy]

ATTACHED 0:0,BlueStreak_F2
ATTACHED 1:0,A_Frame

This is declaring attachments to two different parents AFAIK.

 

[Notebook]

My system is meant to be; Handling_Frame is the parent to two children, BlueStreak_F2, and A_Frame.

In Orbiter, BlueStreak_F2 would be loaded and attached as child to Handling_Frame, these would move to the A_Frame position and Handling_Frame would attach as parent to A_Frame.

At this point Handling_Frame is parent to two children?

Then the composite three vessels would rotate around an anchor point in the x-axis, so _F2 is vertical.
Then _F2 is attached to the Service Tower crane, detached from the Handling_Frame, that and A_Frame rotate back to horizontal, A_Frame is detached, and Handling_Frame returns for the next stage.

Thats the theory...
Of course, not knowing what I'm doing means I have no fear.
N.

 

[Donamy]

Of course, I may be wrong also, but I don't believe you need to declare the parent's attachments like you do for docking ports. Try saving your scenario and see if the lines are still present in the saved scenario.

 

[Notebook]

Donamy, I've no experience with Docking Ports, this is the first time I've used SC3. I went through Vinka's examples, and the Atlantis-rms scnario seemed to be closest to what was needed, so I modified/stole parts of that.

I've gone off on a bit of a tangent now, just noticed A_Frame mesh is 384K, and Handling_Frame mesh is 35K?
Very odd, as they are both made from lofting a rectangle(bit of Max practice for me) and aren't that different in complexity.

I'll get back to this when I've sorted the meshes out.

Many thanks, N.

---------- Post added 13-10-09 at 10:06 ---------- Previous post was 12-10-09 at 18:05 ----------

Sorted the mesh size problem, I'd left the "steps" setting at 6 in the Interpolation roll-out for the spline. Setting it to zero reduced the mesh to 37K. Back to SC3.

This is an .avi of the what I was after:

http://s89.photobucket.com/albums/k207/Notebook_04/?action=view&current=SC3Attachments.flv

It shows the A-Frame animating, and being attached and detached from the Handling_Frame.
It dosen't do what I thought it might, animate the docked meshes, but thinking about it it wouldn't.
The A-Frame animation just applies to the A_Frame groups, so it couldn't affect atached meshes(I think).

There is reference to PARENT= in the SC3.pdf page8/9

• PARENT= : the ANIM_COMP number of the parent if any. The parent must always be​

declared before the child.

Has anyone used this?

If that fails, would making A_Frame a ROBOTIC ARM type work?

All help appreciated.

N.

 

[Donamy]

The parent reference means that the child groups will move with the parent groups, when they are moved, but the parent groupd don't move with the child groups when they are animated. The robotic arm is another option. It is a movable attachment point.

 

[Notebook]

Thanks Donamy, that makes sense.

I think I may be able to cheat with a robotic arm. The A-frame pivots on anchor points, so if I make the anchor points another vessel, and give it a robot arm, then it can grab the handling frame and rotate it to the vertical.

Just gone off to play with Vinkas demos again.

N.

 

[Donamy]

Let me know if you get stuck.

 

[Notebook]

Thanks Donamy, I will, shouldn't be long...

That wasn't long.

I'd never run the Atlantis scenarios before, and I can't get the STS- 102's to run, CTD with missing meshes errors.

The STS-101 will run if you give the mesh path correctly in the .scn files:

[CONFIG]
MESHNAME="atlantis\atlantis"

and

[VC]
MESHNAME="atlantis\atlantis"

It looks as if the mesh groups have been altered somewhere, the animations are wrong.

Haven't been able to get the STS-102 scenarios to work at all.

Went looking for another add-on that uses SC3 robotic arm, and Greg Burch's Pod 3.0 looks good to investigate.

[ame="http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=2866"]Pod 3.0[/ame]

N.

 

[Donamy]

Spacecraft3 vessels always use the "x":spacecraft/spacecraft3 tag in the scenario.

Heare's and examplw of a robotic arm vessel:

[ROBOTIC_ARM]
JOINT_0_NAME="Shoulder YAW"
JOINT_0_SEQ=0
JOINT_0_RANGE=(-90,90)
JOINT_1_NAME="Shoulder PITCH"
JOINT_1_SEQ=1
JOINT_1_RANGE=(-90,90)
JOINT_2_NAME="elbow pitch"
JOINT_2_SEQ=2
JOINT_2_RANGE=(-360,360)
JOINT_3_NAME="wrist pitch"
JOINT_3_SEQ=3
JOINT_3_RANGE=(-360,360)
JOINT_4_NAME="wrist yaw"
JOINT_4_SEQ=4
JOINT_4_RANGE=(-360,360)
JOINT_5_NAME="wrist roll"
JOINT_5_SEQ=5
JOINT_5_RANGE=(-360,360)
GRAP_SEQ=5
GRAP_ATTACH=0
[ANIM_SEQ_0] ;Shoulder yaw
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=60
[ANIM_SEQ_1] ;Shoulder pitch
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=60
[ANIM_SEQ_2] ;elbow pitch
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=60
[ANIM_SEQ_3] ;wrist pitch
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=60
[ANIM_SEQ_4] ;wrist yaw
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=60
[ANIM_SEQ_5] ;wrist roll
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=60
[ANIM_SEQ_6] ;tip
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=60
[ANIM_COMP_0]  ;Shoulder yaw
SEQ=0
GROUPS=0
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_PNT=(-0.25,0.22,-3.98)
ROT_AXIS=(0,1,0)
ANGLE=180
[ANIM_COMP_1]  ;Shoulder pitch
SEQ=1
GROUPS=1
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_PNT=(0.34,0.0,-3.98)
ROT_AXIS=(1,0,0)
ANGLE=180
PARENT=0
[ANIM_COMP_2]   ;elbow pitch
SEQ=2
GROUPS=2
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_PNT=(-0.45,0.00,0.0)
ROT_AXIS=(1,0,0)
ANGLE=360
PARENT=1
[ANIM_COMP_3] ;wrist pitch
SEQ=3
GROUPS=3
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_PNT=(-0.90,0.00,3.8)
ROT_AXIS=(1,0,0)
ANGLE=360
PARENT=2
[ANIM_COMP_4] ;wrist yaw
SEQ=4
GROUPS=4,5
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_PNT=(-0.69,-0.21,4.12)
ROT_AXIS=(0,1,0)
ANGLE=894
PARENT=3
[ANIM_COMP_5] ;wrist roll
SEQ=5
GROUPS=6
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_PNT=(-0.69,0.42,3.90)
ROT_AXIS=(0,0,1)
ANGLE=894
PARENT=4
[ANIM_COMP_6 ; tip
SEQ=6
TIP_1=(-0.69,0.42,5.42)
TIP_2=(-0.69,0.42,6.42)
TIP_3=(-0.69,2.42,5.42)
PARENT=5

 

[Notebook]

Thanks for that Donamy, I shall give it some attention.

Put Greg Burch's pod3 into the scenario, and had a play with the arm.
Seems to do what I want:
http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k207/Notebook_04/09101415-21-16DPod2.jpg

Grabs the handling frame and moves it to the vertical.

just need to make the anchorpoints/A-frame into a mesh/groups that can be made into a robotic arm.

Shouldn't take long...

N.

 

[Donamy]

Remember also, the Child attachment needs the "GS" ID to be grabbed by the robotic Parent attachment.

 

[Notebook]

Thanks for the reminder Donamy, I didn't play much with the ID string, I'd have probably took a while to figure out its needed.

Looking back through your comments, and having a think; in #6 above, are you saying that the ATTACHMENT x:x in a .scn is always treated as a parent?

Thanks, N.

 

[Donamy]

Yes, the child vessel is attached to the parent. The parent vessel doesn't need that line.

 

[Notebook]

Okey Dokey Donamy, one more added to the file!

N.

 

[Notebook]

Been trying various .ini file settings for the RMS arm, and not getting far. Have not been able to grapple, and move the Handling_Frame.

Went back to a working model, Greg Burch's Pod3, and deleted most of the .ini entries to get the bare working parts. This is it:

[CONFIG]
MESHNAME="burchismo\Pd02"
SIZE=8
FOCUS=1
VISIBLE=1
CAMERA=(0,1.151,0.019)
EMPTY_MASS=750
LAUNCH_PT1=(1.5,-2.162,1.59) 
LAUNCH_PT2=(-1.5,-2.162,1.59)
LAUNCH_PT3=(0,-2.162,-1.59)
LAND_PT1=(1.5,-2.162,1.59)
LAND_PT2=(-1.5,-2.162,1.59)
LAND_PT3=(0,-2.162,-1.59)
;================================
;=============================
;======= ANIMATION ========
;======================
;===================
 
[ANIM_SEQ_0]
; Leg Deploy
KEY=G
DURATION=3
[ANIM_SEQ_1]
; Hatch
KEY=K
DURATION=4
[ANIM_SEQ_2]
; Antennas Deploy
KEY=0
DURATION=4
[ANIM_SEQ_3]
; Saddle Stow
KEY=1
DURATION=4
[ANIM_SEQ_4]
; MFDs Stow
KEY=2
DURATION=3
[ANIM_SEQ_5]
; HUD Stow
KEY=3
DURATION=4
[ANIM_COMP_0]
; Front Legs
SEQ=0
GROUPS=62,63,66,67
RANGE=(0,1)
TYPE=TRANSLATE
SHIFT=(0,1.005,-0.847)
[ANIM_COMP_1]
; Rear Legs
SEQ=0
GROUPS=64,65,68,69
RANGE=(0,1)
TYPE=TRANSLATE
SHIFT=(0,0.992,0.837)
[ANIM_COMP_2]
; Hatch
SEQ=1
GROUPS=13,14,15,16,17,18,93
RANGE=(0,0.15)
TYPE=TRANSLATE
SHIFT=(0,0,-0.1)
[ANIM_COMP_3]
; Hatch
SEQ=1
GROUPS=13,14,15,16,17,18,96
RANGE=(0.16,1)
ROT_PNT=(-0.841,0,-1.550)
ROT_AXIS=(0,1,0)
ANGLE=90
[ANIM_COMP_4]
; HGA 1
SEQ=2
GROUPS=42,43,44
RANGE=(0,0.7)
ROT_PNT=(0,0.600,-0.877)
ROT_AXIS=(1,0,0)
ANGLE=-90
[ANIM_COMP_5]
; HGA 2
SEQ=2
GROUPS=42,43
RANGE=(0.71,1)
ROT_PNT=(-0.893,0.600,-0.877)
ROT_AXIS=(0,1,0)
ANGLE=45
[ANIM_COMP_6]
; LGA
SEQ=2
GROUPS=75
RANGE=(0,1)
TYPE=TRANSLATE
SHIFT=(0,1.894,0)
[ANIM_COMP_7]
; Seat
SEQ=3
GROUPS=56,59
RANGE=(0,1)
TYPE=TRANSLATE
SHIFT=(0,-0.740,-0.193)
[ANIM_COMP_8]
; Seat
SEQ=3
GROUPS=58
RANGE=(0,1)
TYPE=TRANSLATE
SHIFT=(0,-0.421,-0.112)
[ANIM_COMP_9]
; ArmRests
SEQ=3
GROUPS=49,54,55
RANGE=(0,1)
ROT_PNT=(0,0.018,-0.546)
ROT_AXIS=(1,0,0)
ANGLE=40
PARENT=7
[ANIM_COMP_10]
; MFDLeft
SEQ=4
GROUPS=76,77,78,79,80
RANGE=(0,1)
ROT_PNT=(-0.828,0.057,0)
ROT_AXIS=(0,0,1)
ANGLE=-72
[ANIM_COMP_11]
; MFDLeft
SEQ=4
GROUPS=81,82,83,84,85
RANGE=(0,1)
ROT_PNT=(0.828,0.057,0)
ROT_AXIS=(0,0,1)
ANGLE=72
 
[ANIM_COMP_12]
; HUD Stalk
SEQ=5
GROUPS=46
RANGE=(0,1)
ROT_PNT=(0,1.418,0.616)
ROT_AXIS=(1,0,0)
ANGLE=20
[ANIM_COMP_13]
; HUD 
SEQ=5
GROUPS=45,98
RANGE=(0,1)
ROT_PNT=(0,1.295,0.301)
ROT_AXIS=(1,0,0)
ANGLE=-100
PARENT=12
; =======
; =========
; ==============
; =======================
; ===== END ANIMATION ===========
;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;===
; ==========
; =============
; ==================
; === ATTACHMENT ===
; =================
; ==============
; =======
[PARENT_ATTACH_0]
NAME="rms"
POS=(0,1.815,-0.125)
DIR=(0,0,1)
ROT=(0,0,1)
LOOSE=0
RANGE=20
ID="GS"
[PARENT_ATTACH_1]
NAME="PILOT_FLOOR"
POS=(0,-1.560,0)
DIR=(0,1,0)
ROT=(1,0,0)
LOOSE=0
RANGE=20
ID="PF"
[CHILD_ATTACH_0]
POS=(0,-2.153,0)
DIR=(0,-1,0)
ROT=(1,0,0)
LOOSE=1
ID="Pod2_BASE"
 
; ============================
; ===================
; ================
; ===== ARM =====
; ================
; ===================
; =============================
[ROBOTIC_ARM]
JOINT_0_NAME="Arm Train"
JOINT_0_SEQ=6
JOINT_0_RANGE=(-180,180)
JOINT_1_NAME="shoulder yaw"
JOINT_1_SEQ=7
JOINT_1_RANGE=(-180,180)
JOINT_2_NAME="shoulder pitch"
JOINT_2_SEQ=8
JOINT_2_RANGE=(-2,145)
JOINT_3_NAME="elbow pitch"
JOINT_3_SEQ=9
JOINT_3_RANGE=(-160,2)
JOINT_4_NAME="wrist pitch"
JOINT_4_SEQ=10
JOINT_4_RANGE=(-120,120)
JOINT_5_NAME="wrist yaw"
JOINT_5_SEQ=11
JOINT_5_RANGE=(-120,120)
JOINT_6_NAME="wrist roll"
JOINT_6_SEQ=12
JOINT_6_RANGE=(-447,447)
GRAP_SEQ=12
GRAP_ATTACH=0
; Arm Train
[ANIM_SEQ_6]
INIT_POS=0
DURATION=5
; shoulder yaw
[ANIM_SEQ_7]
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=60
; shoulder pitch
[ANIM_SEQ_8]
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=20
; elbow pitch
[ANIM_SEQ_9]
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=20
; wrist pitch
[ANIM_SEQ_10]
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=20
; wrist yaw
[ANIM_SEQ_11]
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=10
; wrist roll
[ANIM_SEQ_12]
INIT_POS=0.125
DURATION=20
 
; Arm Train
[ANIM_COMP_14]
SEQ=6
GROUPS=1
RANGE=(0,1)
TYPE=TRANSLATE
SHIFT0=(0,0,0)
SHIFT=(0,0,1.265)
; shoulder yaw
[ANIM_COMP_15]
SEQ=7
RANGE=(0,1)
GROUPS=3
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_AXIS=(0,1,0)
ROT_PNT=(0,1.561,-0.931)
ANGLE=-720
PARENT=14
; shoulder pitch
[ANIM_COMP_16]
SEQ=8
RANGE=(0,1)
GROUPS=4,5
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_AXIS=(1, 0, 0)
ROT_PNT=(0,1.814,-0.854)
ANGLE=245
PARENT=15
; elbow pitch
[ANIM_COMP_17]
SEQ=9
RANGE=(0,1)
GROUPS=6,7
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_AXIS=(1, 0, 0)
ROT_PNT=(0,1.815,1.448)
ANGLE=360
PARENT=16
; wrist pitch
[ANIM_COMP_18]
SEQ=10
RANGE=(0,1)
GROUPS=2
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_AXIS=(1, 0, 0)
ROT_PNT=(0,1.816,-0.488)
ANGLE=360
PARENT=17
; wrist yaw
[ANIM_COMP_19]
SEQ=11
RANGE=(0,1)
GROUPS=8,9
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_AXIS=(0,1,0)
ROT_PNT=(0.008,2.006,-0.295)
ANGLE=360
PARENT=18
; wrist roll
[ANIM_COMP_20]
SEQ=12
RANGE=(0,1)
TIP_1=(0,1.815,-0.125)
TIP_2=(0,1.815,0.125)
TIP_3=(0,2,-0.125)
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_AXIS=(0,0,1)
ROT_PNT=(0,1.815,-0.125)
ANGLE=720
PARENT=19

Basically three parts,
;======= ANIMATION ========
; === ATTACHMENT ===
; ===== ARM =====

I thought it would work with just the Arm and Attachment parts, but it dosen't. Deleteing the Animation part stops the RMS animations, and the Attachment display "arrow" isn't present on the "wrist" position after using Shift-5.
Also if the Handling_Frame is attached, it goes into "limbo", but does return when it is detached.

I've tried other combinations in the ini. file, and I can't find a pattern, but it looks like you need all three parts for a RMS to function.

This is confusing, as the SEQ and ANIM_COMP values in the ANIMATION and ARM parts are not linked?

I'm beginning to think that RMS in Spacecraft3 needs more than just the ARM part?

Any comments, N.