News ULA denied RD-180 engine waiver

[Frilock]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...entagon-denies-ula-waiver-on-russian-engines/

*if there is a better place for this, please move, otherwise I'll leave this here*

'The Pentagon announced Friday that it would not grant the United Launch Alliance a waiver allowing it to bypass a congressional ban on Russian-made engines that the company has said it desperately needs to compete in the multibillion-dollar national security launch market.'

 

[Urwumpe]

... rocket engines don't need to pass emission standards, right? Maybe they allow using German rocket engines... :hmm:

 

[Lmoy]

Poor ULA is going to have to start building their own engines. Or buying from... literally anyone else. Obviously they won't be able to ever launch again. Very sad.

 

[kerlix]

I'm sure Elon is happy.

 

[DaveS]

Poor ULA is going to have to start building their own engines. Or buying from... literally anyone else. Obviously they won't be able to ever launch again. Very sad.

Actually this ban only affects national security payloads such as the ones launched for the NRO. Civilian payloads such as ones launched for NASA are unaffected. Besides, they have Vulcan coming which is the direct replacement for Atlas V and it is going to use the BE-4 CH3/LOX engine from Blue Origin.

 

[boogabooga]

But national security payloads are ULA's bread and butter. Will the BE-4/Vulcain be ready by the time the RD-180s run out?

 

[DaveS]

But national security payloads are ULA's bread and butter. Will the BE-4/Vulcain be ready by the time the RD-180s run out?

It all depends on how ULA manifests the payloads. Some could go onto Delta IV to in order to free up "civilian" RD-180's for NRO payloads. This way to they could stretch the current RD-180 inventory until Vulcan comes online. Currently they're looking at 2019 for that.

 

[N_Molson]

This is ridiculous. USA is going to lose one of its all-time most reliable, adaptable and powerful launchers.

 

[Thunder Chicken]

This is good news in the sense that since it affects NRO payloads, they are going to be pushing for Vulcan. Sucks that the Atlas 5 is out of business, but this will motivate development of next generation rockets. I think it is a net plus.

 

[Andy44]

Vulcan at this point is still just a penny in the wishing well. Atlas is a proven workhorse.

The Boeing half of ULA should be happy, though, since Delta IV is their baby.

 

[GLS]

This is ridiculous. USA is going to lose one of its all-time most reliable, adaptable and powerful launchers.

Is it? Or is this normal or expected, and ridiculous was building "one of its all-time most reliable, adaptable and powerful launchers" from foreign technology?

 

[Andy44]

Is it? Or is this normal or expected, and ridiculous was building "one of its all-time most reliable, adaptable and powerful launchers" from foreign technology?

There is nothing wrong with foreign trade, that is one of the strengths of the modern Atlas program.

This is a political problem, not an engineering one.

If the Atlas builders can find a suitable replacement engine, it's likely to be more costly than the RD-180, not even counting development costs.

In hindsight, of course, you are correct, but nobody in the 1990s could've seen how things would change.

 

[MaverickSawyer]

I'm sure Elon is happy.

Actually, it's Jeff Bezos who's quite happy.

 

[ADSWNJ]

It always seemed weird to me that US National Security payloads would be lofted on Russian engines. Given the state of relations between the two old adversaries, it's not surprising that this ban was executed.

 

[PeterRoss]

It always seemed weird to me that US National Security payloads would be lofted on Russian engines. Given the state of relations between the two old adversaries, it's not surprising that this ban was executed.

Come on, we're eating your American Snickers chocolate bars since 1991 although its taste is pretty awful. What's wrong with you using our rocket engines? Snickers dependency has more destructive potential than dependency on RD-180 anyway.

And then again there is dependency on Windows OS too. Our officials are thinking about switching to Lunix, mind you. What will you do if we stop pirating your Windows?:lol:

 

[Frilock]

Its a unix system!

 

[Andy44]

Come on, we're eating your American Snickers chocolate bars since 1991 although its taste is pretty awful. What's wrong with you using our rocket engines? Snickers dependency has more destructive potential than dependency on RD-180 anyway.

And then again there is dependency on Windows OS too. Our officials are thinking about switching to Lunix, mind you. What will you do if we stop pirating your Windows?:lol:

As long as you keep supplying the world with female tennis players I'm good.

 

[ADSWNJ]

Come on, we're eating your American Snickers chocolate bars since 1991 although its taste is pretty awful. What's wrong with you using our rocket engines? Snickers dependency has more destructive potential than dependency on RD-180 anyway.

And then again there is dependency on Windows OS too. Our officials are thinking about switching to Lunix, mind you. What will you do if we stop pirating your Windows?:lol:

I guess I'm still bitter after Ilya Kovalchuk left my beloved NJ Devils for the KHL, walking away from a $100m contract :huh:

My point was not that Russia and the USA should trade with each other, but rather that the spy apparatus of the USA should be dependent on the rocket technology of the country (amongst others) that they would spy on.

 

[PeterRoss]

My point was not that Russia and the USA should trade with each other, but rather that the spy apparatus of the USA should be dependent on the rocket technology of the country (amongst others) that they would spy on.

Yep. And now try to imagine how the whole story with Mistral ships were looking like from Russian perspective. The carrier ship is not exactly a spy satelite, but some piece of strategic military equipment nonetheless. Being bought from potential enemy, NATO member. And the deal actually were used against us as a part of economical warfare.

Selling weapons to other countries is absolutely logical if you look at it as a tradeable goods. And it's absolutely illogical if it can be used against you. Noone can say for sure if your current ally you're supplying with weapon today will stay your ally in the next decade. But this doesn't stop countries from selling weapons to everyone else. Yep, money rules. Free market and stuff.

And the rocket engine isn't even a weapon.

 

[Andy44]

Lots of American-made pickup trucks are being sold on the used market, and turn up in the hands of ISIL, AQ, and other assorted ne'er-do-wells like this poor guy: http://houston.cbslocal.com/2014/12...no-idea-how-company-truck-ended-up-with-isis/

Selling actual weapons is one thing. But that Russian engine was also used by Atlas to propel the New Horizons probe to Pluto, and it hasn't been used to launch any weapons, as far as we know.